bashan
Recruit
Stripped QMJ157, easy to work on
Posts: 37
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Post by bashan on Mar 6, 2010 19:38:04 GMT -5
LOL
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Post by Rebel on Mar 9, 2010 12:33:47 GMT -5
Well at least you are getting free parts for the fix then. I hope all goes well on the assembly.
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Post by sunrider on Mar 10, 2010 15:05:28 GMT -5
The waiting........................................................................ .......................................................................................... Ugh
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Post by Rebel on Mar 10, 2010 15:21:20 GMT -5
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Post by sunrider on Mar 20, 2010 16:25:10 GMT -5
LOL! Patience my ass... I got the parts Wednesday, and he's busy rebuilding HDs, so I got it back today, ready to try the rebuild myself tomorrow. Tentatively with someone who's rebuilt small engines before. Anyway, aside from the normal oil, are there any other fluids / sealants / glues or anything I should get tonight, for a top end rebuild from the cylinder, piston, on up?
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Post by sunrider on Mar 20, 2010 21:32:40 GMT -5
Well, I (hopefully) have the top end rebuilt. I'm a little scared though, because I have a couple of small rubber washers Jay threw in my kit that I can't figure out where they go. Also, I think I received the wrong size gaskets for my chain tensioner, the gasket's center hole is smaller than the tensioner (plug?) the large part that goes in the engine. I am really scared of extra pieces! Since they (2 gaskets same size) didnt fit, I thought maybe they were for the exhaust, and didn't discover until later that the gaskets are a little shorter than the exhaust bolt holes... So, I have 2 small black rubber washers, about 1/4 inch deep with a 1/4 inch hole, and 2 paper gaskets that match the intake manifold and chain tensioner bolts but don't allow the tensioner to go through... Do I just need to cut some paper out of one of those?
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Post by sunrider on Mar 21, 2010 16:51:11 GMT -5
Ok, another Homer moment... I tried starting my bike for 2 hours without the spark plug wire, DOH!!! I'm running now, it sounds good ;D Two questions, though...
I did not put the engine shroud back on, because half of it melted during my last troubleshooting session 2 weeks ago. Should I replace it anyway? Is it dangerous (for Chameleon) to run without the shroud?
The electric system on this thing is driving me NUTS! Everything works except the headlights, just have the dim backups working. I've checked their plugs, and their couplers, can't find any disconnections, have inspected the wires for shorts or cuts, don't see any... I have disonnected my mirror lights because they were shorting out a couple months back, and that made my headlights not work, but I don't see any shorts now... Any other ideas?
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Post by jct842 on Mar 21, 2010 21:13:32 GMT -5
try going backwards with meter from the head lights to the switch then to fuse and then the battery. you need the shroud to get cooling air to the engine. with out it you are going to over heat and get in trouble again. that engine sure must have been hot when you fried it. get the shroud. john
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Post by Rebel on Mar 21, 2010 23:03:33 GMT -5
Sorry, I have been busy doing repair on my mower and then mowing and few other things, how is it now. I would get a new shroud for it.
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bashan
Recruit
Stripped QMJ157, easy to work on
Posts: 37
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Post by bashan on Mar 22, 2010 18:11:15 GMT -5
Ok, another Homer moment... I tried starting my bike for 2 hours without the spark plug wire, DOH!!! I'm running now, it sounds good ;D Two questions, though... I did not put the engine shroud back on, because half of it melted during my last troubleshooting session 2 weeks ago. Should I replace it anyway? Is it dangerous (for Chameleon) to run without the shroud? The electric system on this thing is driving me NUTS! Everything works except the headlights, just have the dim backups working. I've checked their plugs, and their couplers, can't find any disconnections, have inspected the wires for shorts or cuts, don't see any... I have disonnected my mirror lights because they were shorting out a couple months back, and that made my headlights not work, but I don't see any shorts now... Any other ideas? Hey Sun, I don't know if this will help but I thought I'd throw it out there, I found a simplified colored wiring chart that's easier to follow and it expands very clearly on the PDF. It's at the bottom of the manuals & charts page on my site. Give it a look, it shows the wires to the headlights and such. Just a thought. Rich
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Post by sunrider on Mar 24, 2010 15:08:55 GMT -5
Thanks Rich, and Rebel. The wiring thing is kind've on pause, since it started pouring smoke out my tailpipe today. I'm burning large amounts of oil. About 1/2 dipstick today I have a feeling oil is leaking back into my combustion chamber through my valve head, but that's just a guess, because I'm not really familiar, and I put it together on my own this weekend. I started it up without the valve cover on just to see what's happening (again, I'm not really familiar with how everything works yet, learning process, but I have seen videos of people doing this, so I thought it might be safe for a second or two. I saw a large amount of oil (maybe ~50cc) looked like it was coming out of my exhaust port (I may be wrong about the origin, but it was definitely running out of my head onto the floor without the cover on, so I shut it off real quick.). I have two rubber washers that came in my cylinder / piston replacement kit. I could not figure where they went. They are the diameter of the valve spring retainers, with a hole just about the right size for a tappet, about 1/8" of an inch thick, black rubber washers. Are these the cause of my smoking woes? Where do they go?? I hate being so dumb...
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Post by Rebel on Mar 24, 2010 17:54:40 GMT -5
Got the top end off, and discovered everything from the cylinder up needs to be replaced. GES has agreed to replace it all, big relief! www.flickr.com/photos/37743438@N07/Broken air intake tube, broken exhaust valve spring, exhaust valve seat pieces embedded in my piston and valve head and scoring up the cylinder. As Jay called it, "A rather glorious explosion". I didn't get an odo pic emailed before 6 on Friday, so I suppose I should hear back Monday what I'm getting. OK did you mean cylinder and top end, or just the head? Please tell me that you did replace the piston and cylinder, or at minimum get the cylinder honed and it checked out close enough for a stock piston. Now if you put a new piston and set of rings in, did you know that you needed to have the rings off set so that the oil does no go into the combustion chamber and the compression is not blown into the crank case? If not you may have to pull it back apart and move the rings around. classically they tell you to have the ring gap set at 120 degrees off from the other ring gaps, visualize a Mercedes Benz emblem. You also said something about a gasket not looking quite right, wrong gasket can be a problem too. Any way it goes though, you are doing good, since you got it running, now we just have to figure out if you need to take it back apart and do it over again.
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Post by kliff on Mar 24, 2010 19:10:55 GMT -5
From the video I just glanced at on SD, you're running with no cooling shrouds on the cylinder, or at least one of them is gone.
The engine is toast. The guys at GES done you right, its a FAN cooled engine, and requires fan shrouds....with out them, bad things happen. Start over, new piston, cylinder, head and gaskets, this time on you. Oh yeah, ... did he gap yours rings? .004" per 1" of bore..... minimum .008" for a GY6 150, I prefer .009 top, .o10" second and .010 on the scraper rails.
Did you reset the tension on the cam chain tensioner, or just bolt it down. If you didn't, get new cam chain, and guides....gotta split the cases to replace the chain...
From the sound of it....you're gonna need it.
BBut the shroud is what done you in...... you know this ain't a contest to see how many left over parts you can have when doing engine work. It more about everything in it's place and fitted properly, if not, be prepared to do it again...
left over gaskets, from a new kit, not unusual, sometimes the kits fit more than one specific.
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Post by sunrider on Mar 24, 2010 19:18:34 GMT -5
Hey thanks Rebel. Here's an update, but first your questions: I got a new piston and rings, (GES test bike) cylinder, head, rocker assembly (pre-assembled), cam, and valve cover. I'm pretty sure everything but the piston came off the test bike. I did not have the bore measured before installing it. I did set the rings at 120 degrees, but I spent 60-90 minutes getting it into the bore, so I am NOT positive that I didn't rotate a couple gaps to line up during that process. I drained today's oil (70 miles), the dipstick said I had 1/2 tank when I got home - it had definitely been burning some based on the smell and smoke. It sat a few hours, then I started it up for 30 seconds and drained the oil. It came out looking kinda thickish with a yellowish almost foam sitting on top. What came out was about 1/8" deep in a small bedpan I've been using as my oil catcher. Sure didn't look like 1/2 tank... www.flickr.com/photos/37743438@N07/4460461477/ I also took off the fan cover and turned the fan while I had the drain plug and dipstick out. I could hear and feel the compression releasing if I held it against compression or turned really slowly. When I replaced the plug and dip, I couldn't hear it any more, but I could definitely feel the decompression. I started it for about 3 seconds with the valve cover off, and I don't know what's exactly supposed to happen, but it seemed like a large amount of oil coming out of my exhaust port. It might've been coming from somewhere else, I was reaching for the kill switch since my pan was missing the oil... I know I'm supposed to get some oil up there to lube the cam and rockers, but I'm not sure where it should be coming in from. My impression at the time was that it was getting pushed in through the exhaust port from the chamber. It was about 10-20 mL in that 3 seconds... These are the two washers that I didn't find a place for... They are rubber, maybe 1/16" - 1/8" thick, and about the same diameter as a valve spring retainer. Don't know where they go, and I couldn't find them on any of the parts I'd taken out, so I thought maybe the old ones were still where they need to be... Might've been a bad assumption, I know... I'm trying to learn the right way... www.flickr.com/photos/37743438@N07/4460381825/in/photostream/
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Post by sunrider on Mar 24, 2010 19:27:39 GMT -5
Kliff, I put the shroud back on Monday. I took it back off today when I got home, I was about ready to dive down to the piston, but I wanted to make sure it wasn't something much simpler first. I've only been running it for 30 seconds tops without the cover on. I do have a hole in the shroud wherever it was directly over the exhaust lead pipe, but would that reduce the cooling functionality?
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