numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 25, 2009 14:52:46 GMT -5
First, I want to say THANK YOU to everyone that has helped me with this bike in the last 6 months. I've made some stupid choices, but thanks to you all I got it back on the road this week! Here's the bike's current config: 170cc big bore Main jet 110 Uni sock filter on the intake Breather tube from valve cover running into a soda can (until I get a proper oil catch can) The hole in the crankcase is slightly out-of-round towards the bottom. I actually took the bike to a mechanic to help get it properly sealed up and not leaking. Rode it for several days and it ran great. Today I was riding it WOT, and as I was riding I saw smoke coming from between my legs. Oops! (Note, I don't have all of the body panels on.) When I opened up my seat, I saw smoke coming out of that can. I went to start the bike back up, and it wouldn't start unless I opened up the throttle a bit, and it stalls out every time I let go of the throttle. I let the engine cool completely down (about 3 hours in fact), and it was slow to start, but it did - initially. Once it was slightly warm it resumed its previous behavior and stalled unless I opened up the throttle a bit. So one - I can't help but think there shouldn't be smoke coming out of that breather tube, and also the bike should idle without help. I'm not opposed to taking it back to the mechanic, but I thought I'd ask around here first, see if something rings a bell. It seems to run okay aside from the smoking - the first thing I thought of was blow-by on the piston rings, that perhaps I failed to break it in properly and oil was getting into the combustion chamber, but aside from tearing the engine back down yet agian, I'm not sure of how to test for it.
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 25, 2009 15:12:58 GMT -5
Just in case anyone cares - you might recall I was sick back early in the summer. It took me almost a full 8 weeks to get well. I had a piece of pork impacted in my sinus that was infected, and in turn made me incredibly ill. Even my scalp got infected and I had to shave my head to get rid of it! Ugh...
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 25, 2009 15:25:30 GMT -5
Oh. Crap. wiki.answers.com/Q/What_causes_white_or_gray_smoke_to_come_out_of_the_valve_cover_pvc_opening_and_hose_to_the_air_cleanerI took the scooter to the car wash yesterday, and since I had a motor oil mess all over the inside of the scoot from working on it, I sprayed it down with simple green and while at the car wash I sprayed it out really good. CRAP! Now what? I had a "fixed" scooter and I manage to break it by washing it??? Ugh - it's entirely possible that I've already cracked the head if it won't idle. That or I popped a valve spring driving WOT. Bleh - always gotta be something. Could have blown gasket too. Seems like there's never and end to it.
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 25, 2009 16:35:55 GMT -5
Ran it a little with the valve cover off. The exhaust valve seems to be moving okay. There's a pretty decent amount of oil coming out from the head. Not a huge flow, but more than I would have expected - enough that I put a drip tray down for it.
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Post by kliff on Oct 25, 2009 16:46:45 GMT -5
While you have the cover off, I'd do a magnifying glass inspection of the springs. Could have also done in the piston or rings...
110 main....what mods have you done? I'm running a 110, with a drilled stock muffler, and 2 additional 1.5" holes in the main air box, and I'm borderline lean...
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 25, 2009 19:13:20 GMT -5
Muffler's drilled and I have a sock filter instead of the stock airbox. I've suspected that I might be running lean, but I was just happy to have the thing running again. Was going to worry about fine tuning next week. So far as the piston/rings - I was thinking that I may have hosed the break-in and the rings never seated properly. I'll have to hunt down a magnifying lens to inspect the springs.
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Post by kuzikood on Oct 25, 2009 20:14:15 GMT -5
i was wonderin how ya were numbski glad ya got it running again , i wouldnt be too worried about a lil smoke out of the breather , as long as it isnt comin out the tailpipe i wouldnt worry about it bein the rings, as far as the jets go no higher than a 103 main you have a scoot that likes to run lean like mine does , think about it mine is happy with a 105 running a uni and a p&p exaust so its not unusaul as far as not wanting to idle what rpm is it when it stays running you said open a lil bit what rmp is that ?
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 25, 2009 20:24:51 GMT -5
I don't have a tachometer, so anything I say would be a guess. I'm barely twisting the throttle though.
We're talking billowing smoke though - it's not instantaneous, but it gets pretty bad.
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Post by kuzikood on Oct 25, 2009 20:33:53 GMT -5
as long as its out the top breather and not exaust its prolly not the rings
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Post by kuzikood on Oct 25, 2009 20:40:33 GMT -5
i know its best to purpose build things but im of the im to broke, lazy, un-intent or whatever to go to the store and get what i need so i make what i need out of what is at hand. lol
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Post by Doug in San Diego on Oct 25, 2009 21:56:48 GMT -5
Am I the only one? WHAT? ??!!!!!!!! A piece of PORK!!!! impacted in your SINUS!!! I've done milk and soda, but never pork! That must have been a hell of an 8 weeks! I bet it could have been one week if the doctor didn't blow you of the first time with some low-level antibiotics. Took them 8 weeks to finally diagnose my sinus problem. Glad to hear you are all fixed I have nothing to add on the scooter problem. I just had to throw in my HOLY Sh*% on the pork thing
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Post by Rebel on Oct 25, 2009 22:28:32 GMT -5
OK back on track here, but yes all kinds of things get in the sinus cavity and pork in there is just bad news. Good job on the pics, but that was another thread, I'll move it over there.
Smoking from an air vent/breather can be a sign of engine wear, it is possibly blow-by and that would be worn rings at least.
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 26, 2009 6:36:54 GMT -5
Just sucks if that's true. Brand new piston, rings, and of course cylinder. I've got just under 100 miles on them (was going to change the oil today in fact...)
Yes, pork. They had me do a CT scan, and thought I had either a polyp or cancer. Oi. Should have gone straight to the ear, nose, and throat specialist. What's done is done.
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Post by Rebel on Oct 26, 2009 11:21:25 GMT -5
OK if have such low mileage on the rings/piston. Did you hone the cylinder before you put it all together? Honing is using an abrasive tool such a as cylinder hone or glaze buster to put a cross hatch pattern in the wall of the cylinder, it makes it slightly rough so that the new rings have something to wear it into a seal making it "seat" the rings. hone this i what I call a glaze buster; if it was a big bore kit it really should have come ready to put together. And I could be all wet too. Smoke normally comes from either oil burning or running too rich and black smoke coming out the tail pipe.
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numbski
Non-Com
Sargeant, Ist Bt, 2nd Brigade, Mechanics Apprentice, BRONZE STAR 11/01/09, for having continued, when others would have QUIT!
Posts: 91
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Post by numbski on Oct 26, 2009 12:49:18 GMT -5
I took it to have it honed at a machine shop. They were going to ball hone it, but then they came back and said they had to block hone it to fix a clearance issue (it's a high-compression piston), and the fact that it was a separate piston from the cylinder is the reason it needed honed. I think? So yes - I paid $100 to have the thing block-honed. The piston came with its own ring kit. I still have the piston and rings that came with the big bore kit, but obviously that won't work now that it's been honed to let the new piston clear. No smoke out the tailpipe - in fact it's clean coming out the back. I put my hand back there just to make sure it was going, and I could feel puffs coming out from the cycles, so it's not like the exhaust valve isn't opening. My fear is that oil is getting past the rings into the combustion chamber, and eventually so much gets in there that it can't even idle with opening the throttle. With the hole in the crankcase being out-of-round towards the bottom, I'm not sure if that would facilitate excessive oil in the bore or not.
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