Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2013 1:06:33 GMT -5
I think only the better scoots are 4 cycle and only 50 ccs.
COGRATS
is your battery ground wire tight on the engine/frame
test your spark in the complete dark.
was wondering how you are re charging your battery after all this.
DOES ANYONE KNOW IF BAD CDI TIMING CAN STOP A MOTOR FROM STARTING.
ALL THE STARTING SPRAYS I HAVE FOUND SMOTHER MY ENGINE
i AM SORRY maybe redundant to ask, but have you tried a new plug
also, check the coil connections, pinch the flag connectors near the wire pinch, but not on the opening at end and put back on, those things loose has driven many a biker to maddness.
also pull spark wire, carfully unscrew the plug cap and connection to coil,,,check for the wire to be making good contact at both ends
you will start this bike, know it is coming, but a much better and wiser guy will ride it then the guy who first brought it home.
god's just looking after you buddy, knowing the bikes tricks is real POWER plus like WOW DUDE, look at this huge pit crew you've acquired hahahahahahah
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Post by atv1234 on Apr 10, 2013 21:21:28 GMT -5
Haha, I know its quite a crew here now lol. Yea I am hopeful this thing will be running soon, hopefully I am still owning it when it does lol.
Yea, the battery cable is tight on the frame and valve cover. I have been using a battery tender to charge the battery back up. I had been questioning this CDI since day one, but figured since I had spark it was ok. I had been told that when they go out, they just completely stop working, but when researching I noticed some people saying they had spark but it wouldn't start until they changed the CDI. So I am not sure what to think. It does seem like some sort of timing issue at this point. I am going to check for the sheered flywheel this weekend. If that's not it, or the CDI, then I will be really stumped lol.
I did check the intake manifold, and decided to spray some starter fluid directly into there, with the carb and intake vacuum line removed, and it finally fired and ran for a second! But with the carb back on (vacumm line both on and off) and spraying starter fluid it was back to just turning over. I would think with the starter fluid, it shouldn't matter if the carb is on or off, I should get the same result I would think. I checked the butterfly too to make sure it was moving with the throttle and it was.
Oh, and I have a new plug that I put in after I cleaned the carb and drained the old gas. I still have the old too, and I've tried both. Maybe I should get another one?
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Post by atv1234 on Apr 14, 2013 12:31:39 GMT -5
Ok so the flywheel checked out and was fine. I readjusted the valves and can now get it to fire. But its still very hard to start. I soaked the carb and cleaned it once more, adjusted the float to factory specs, adjusted the mixture screw, and still not much of a change. Before, the only way it would start was if the mixture screw was closed (factory specs is 2 turns out). I am not sure what that suggests, other than maybe it was already getting a lot of fuel? Also, after I did get it running I drove it around for awhile, then checked the plug and it is definitely running lean, with the plug almost white.
Any suggestions on what it might be?
I am becoming less and less of a fan of these Chinese scooters. They seem more like Chinese torture at this point more than anything else lol.
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Post by Rebel on Apr 14, 2013 12:38:08 GMT -5
Sorry you are having so much trouble.
Have you got a second carb you can try on it? When you had it apart did you check the diaphragm for holes in it?
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jmkjr72
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Commander 132nd Northern Cav. Division
Posts: 2,779
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Post by jmkjr72 on Apr 14, 2013 16:13:01 GMT -5
Did you pull the jets out of the carb and clean the jets Do not put wire through them they are soft brass I use a bristle from a stiff paintbrush You NEed to make sure you can see through the jets
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Post by atv1234 on Apr 15, 2013 14:00:42 GMT -5
I just ordered another carb that will be here Friday so I will try that and see. Yea I have checked everything in the carb that is on there now. The diaphragms seemed fine, and I had even read many people saying to boil carbs in lemon juice to thoroughly clean them. So I took everything off the carb again and boiled the carb and the jets, then sprayed it all out with carb cleaner, compressed air, and ran wire through the jets as well before reassembling. I always point the jets to the sky and make sure I can see through them too before putting them back in. I have never seen anything more temperamental than this thing. Its strange too because its extremely hard to start, but once it finally does start it runs fairly decent. It idles, revs up fine, and will cruise at about 32mph. But once you shut it off, forget it, its back to square one trying to start it again. I even checked the valves AGAIN and they were fine. The GY6 manual says .005 for both, yet ive seen other manuals say .004 for intake and .005 for exhaust, and also .004 for both, I've tried all of them with the same result.
Hopefully this new carb fixes the problem. If it doesn't I may just part this thing out.
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Post by Rebel on Apr 15, 2013 14:57:40 GMT -5
I know one guy that suggest 0.003 on them too.
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Post by atv1234 on Apr 15, 2013 22:14:27 GMT -5
Hmm, I will try that then if the new carb doesn't change anything. I was wondering too maybe if the intake manifold or gasket was cracked, causing it to be sucking in more air? Would that make it hard to start? I would think that would also limit top speed though?
While it was running I sprayed carb cleaner all over the engine to see if the engine responded at all, and it remained the same. Is there another way to test it for cracks?
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Post by Rebel on Apr 16, 2013 1:11:18 GMT -5
Hmm, I will try that then if the new carb doesn't change anything. I was wondering too maybe if the intake manifold or gasket was cracked, causing it to be sucking in more air? Would that make it hard to start? I would think that would also limit top speed though? While it was running I sprayed carb cleaner all over the engine to see if the engine responded at all, and it remained the same. Is there another way to test it for cracks? I doubt adjusting to 0.003 would make the difference to get it running, I just tossed those numbers out for general info. Spraying the carb cleaner all over while running should find a leak, the only other way that I an aware of is just looking for a off hose a broken one or a cracked one.
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jmkjr72
contributing staff
Commander 132nd Northern Cav. Division
Posts: 2,779
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Post by jmkjr72 on Apr 16, 2013 10:41:21 GMT -5
Propane works also it is heavier then air But the key is keeping it running long enough to test
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Post by atv1234 on Apr 22, 2013 16:21:10 GMT -5
Well I am back at it with this thing. I put on a brand new carb with the same results, no start. Last weekend I had changed the oil in it since I didn't know when it was last changed, and noticed when I was transferring the old oil into a container to dispose of, there were some metal pieces at the bottom. That definitely got my attention, yet there was already a whole bunch of debris in the pan prior to when I drained the oil so I am not 100% sure if it came from the scooter. Regardless, I wanted to do a compression test again just to verify. Last week it was at 150psi, now I cant get anything, it bounces up to 60 then back to 0 with each revolution but doesn't seem to hold the pressure, just a continuous bounce. I am using a harbor freight tester and I can't seem to tell if I am getting tight enough, so that may be why the bad reading. Anyway, it would make sense if compression was bad why if would've been hard to start, yet when I would get it running I could cruise at 32mph and it was still hard to start even at 150psi, which should be plenty enough to start I would think.
Anyway, are there other issues I could check that could be causing low compression before opening the engine up.?
An engine rebuild is something I have no experience in, so if it comes time for that things could get interesting lol.
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jmkjr72
contributing staff
Commander 132nd Northern Cav. Division
Posts: 2,779
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Post by jmkjr72 on Apr 22, 2013 17:39:35 GMT -5
The hf compression gauges are junk But he fact you cant get a reading above 60 and it doesnt hold is a good sign something went kerchunk in the engine And if it was a Compression ring that failed that my explain it If you had access to a boreascope that might help see what went kerchunk
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Post by Rebel on Apr 22, 2013 18:01:38 GMT -5
metal chunks in the oil is never a good sign.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2013 0:22:04 GMT -5
I know one guy that suggest 0.003 on them too. 003 is a better run on the gas, its more responsive, but the exhaust valve needs to never go below 004,as it expands in heat.
004 is a quicker heat disposal of exhaust gas's over the long haul.
the way to do this is my way.
boy did'nt you always just want to tell some one my way is the "WAY"
I AM JOKING
but as to not have to worry about a valve closing on you because of a tight adjust, do this.
remove the adjustment nut, spray it dam good and the threads with break cleaner,
reset intake NUT WET WITH LOCKTIGHT BLUE to oo3,
clean/reset apply lock tight blue exhaust to 004,
heat dry the nuts with a hair dryer
oil has never dissolved my lock tight
done right, this will last you 5000 miles or more.
AND REMEMBER CAREFUL ON TORQUE PRESSURE I need to do this to my new engine soon.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2013 0:45:18 GMT -5
Anyway, are there other issues I could check that could be causing low compression before opening the engine up.? An engine rebuild is something I have no experience in, so if it comes time for that things could get interesting lol. tho rare you can blow a seal, and the metal chunks could have been there a long time. I WOULD GO BACK AND RECHECK EVERYTHING, if that yields no results open it up but i would price out a new engine with good research as i went in. your HF pressure tool is junk. Maybe in your sequence of search you missed something.
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